Talk:Felek al-Din Dündar

Felek al-Din Dündar is currently a Royalty, nobility and heraldry good article nominee. Nominated by Aintabli (talk) at 17:45, 7 March 2024 (UTC)

An editor has placed this article on hold to allow improvements to be made to satisfy the good article criteria. Recommendations have been left on the review page, and editors have seven days to address these issues. Improvements made in this period will influence the reviewer's decision whether or not to list the article as a good article.

Short description: Beg of Hamid from c. 1300 to 1326

Biography: Military / Royalty and Nobility

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Military history: Biography / Middle East / Early Muslim C‑class

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This article has been rated as C-class on the project's quality scale.

This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
Referencing and citation: criterion not met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion met

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GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Felek al-Din Dündar/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Aintabli (talk · contribs) 17:45, 7 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reviewer: Cplakidas (talk · contribs) 11:35, 8 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Will take this on hopefully within the next few days/week. Constantine ✍ 11:35, 8 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)

It is reasonably well written.
a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
It is factually accurate and verifiable, as shown by a source spot-check.
a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism):
It is broad in its coverage.
a (major aspects): b (focused):
It follows the neutral point of view policy.
Fair representation without bias:
It is stable.
No edit wars, etc.:
It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall:
Pass/Fail:

As usual, the article is fairly well written and well referenced. Some questions, suggestions, and nitpicks follow:

was Beg of Hamid give a brief gloss of Beg (e.g. ruler) and locate Hamid in southwestern Anatolia
Done
in times of internal struggles in the east the average reader won't know that this means the Ilkhanate, or the Ilkhanate's authority in Anatolia; be a bit more direct.
Tried to clarify.
Would Yunus, Mahmud, Khidr Beg, Hamid Beg, the Grand Mosque of Burdur, the Dündar Bey Medrese/Taşmedrese, Suleiman II warrant redlinks?
Linked.
Link Anatolia at the first instance.
Done
, where he served Recommend starting a new sentence here.
Done
granted him land clarify this is Hamid Beg
Done
Mongol invasions and conquests in this context, the full title is somewhat odd; perhaps just 'Mongol conquests'?
Done. I should've used a piped link.
Is it the same Hamid Beg who was active in 1240 that rebelled against the Mongols in 1290 and was active as late as 1300? How old was he then?
Yes, it's the same person. None of the sources specify his age. The gap and the unclear time frame is expected given the lack of detailed historical sources on the dynasty.
BTW the list of Hamidid rulers in Hamidids contains neither Hamid not Khidr Beg. There's no source there, so I am ready to believe that it is incorrect or out of date, but still the discrepancy should be fixed.
My general plan when it comes to these kinds of articles is to first sort out the biographical articles and then start editing that of the dynasty. But yeah, it is safe to assume the list is incorrect/missing information. It already skips a few years after Dündar.
referred to him as as-Sultanu'l-a'zam wa padishahu'l-muazzam sultan-ı selatinu'l-Arab wa'l-Ajam as-Sultan Hamid provide a gloss at least in a footnote
Done Aintabli (talk) 18:49, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The 'Early life and background' is mostly about Dündar's grandfather Hamid, and not about Dündar. Per WP:SS I would recommend condensing it significantly (and creating an article on Hamid Beg in the process would be a good idea).
Trimmed and linked Hamid Beg.
Gloss ispahsalar. BTW I discovered that Template:gloss exists that you can use to denote such cases.
Done
The latter was easier to defend 'The latter' refers to the 'frontier region with the Byzantine Empire', change to Eğirdir.
Done
reparation means something different, 'repair' is correct here or 'renovation'
Done
'nickname' is a bit inaccurate; 'regnal name' or 'honorific name' is better.
Chose honorific name.
A few duplicate links, e.g. for the Ilkhanate.
Removed. Thank you.
fallen Seljuk rule. 'fallen Seljuk state' or 'defunct Seljuk rule'
Done
reenact Ilkhanid authority 'reestablish Ilkhanid authority'
Done
where Dündar similar to most Turkmen lords 'where Dündar, like most Turkmen rulers of Anatolia' or similar. Suggest avoiding 'lords' as it has a distinctly Western feudal connotation that does not apply here.
Done
Link robe of honor
Done
The Ilkhanid authority was at stake following Chupan's departure from Anatolia, and the internal struggles caused by twelve-year-old Abu Sa'id Bahadur Khan's (r. 1316–35) rise to the throne when his father Öljaitü died in December 1316 something is missing here. Perhaps (if I understand the meaning correctly) 'Ilkhanid authority in Anatolia was soon weakened again after Chupan's departure, especially due to the internal struggles caused by the death of Öljaitü and the rise of his twelve-year-old son Abu Sa'id Bahadur Khan's (r. 1316–35) to the throne'?
Reworded slightly.
although he did not directly use his name in his silver coins from 1321, Dündar dropped Abu Sa'id's mention does this mean that until 1321 he had Abu Sa'id on his coins? I would state that directly.
Done
Then, Dündar ruled over nine cities What year does 'then' refer to?
In those times.
30 thousand per MOS, either '30,000' or 'thirty thousand'.
Changed to 'thirty thousand'.
troops and cavalry cavalry are also troops; perhaps 'infantry and cavalry' or 'foot and horse'?
Oh shoot, that's correct. Replaced with infantry.
Timurtash pursued him last person named is Mahmud
Mentioned Dündar and slightly changed wording.
a short while after the Eshrefid ruler Suleiman's death 'shortly after the death of the Eshrefid ruler Suleiman II'
Done Aintabli (talk) 19:14, 24 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Give ISBN for Bosworth, per the other print sources cited
Done
ru:Дюндар-бей Хамидид has more sources referenced, it would be good to at least have a look that nothing major has been left out.
Checked the page. I can't see any major details that were left out. The Russian article names several more historical sources/historians some of the information found in both articles come from. The Russian version also explains that earlier historians identified Dündar and Hamid Beg as the same person. There is a brief discussion of Dündar's burial place. I have added the relevant source (Üçok) and a few sentences about the speculation on where Dündar's grave is located.

That's it for a first pass. Constantine ✍ 14:41, 14 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Cplakidas:, thank you for your patience and meticulous review once again. Let me know if you want me to add the above missing details from the Russian-language version. I will most likely add them later when I return to editing this topic area, but if you feel like these are details that should be added during the review, feel free to point that out. Aintabli (talk) 03:15, 25 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]